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Our college experts assure students that we are about consistency and devotion. Now my mind set is that of endure and get done, fake it till you make it. It gives me flexibility around my family and perhaps over the rainbow there would be an academic career awaiting me. I have visualized so many times myself as in one of TW recent posts Parenting your way to a PhD receiving my PhD on a stage with my boys watching me from the audience.

Time has passed and the more I look around the more I realize that the lifestyles of those who inspire me and have become my role models are so different to mine in terms of family commitments. I am not willing anymore of making my PhD the centre piece of my life; I am not in such position.

I want to be available at home for my children as well as at University. I am very hard working, but my priorities have shifted. Which leads me to think, why should I bother with this? Under the circumstances I am in I feel I would have to settle for a second rate academic career. The more productive people I know are the ones that work hrs a week and juggle their children and their laptops, the ones that have family holidays on the places they do field work, the ones that send their family on holidays while they go to conferences.

Why should I settle for this? I had a career before and the recession seems over in certain economic sectors and in mine I know I could back now to a more senior post and a better salary. A job where at 5 I would close my computer and my brain to anything other than my family.

It is certainly tempting earning more money, having a pension, being on a progression path now and not waiting and seeing in 3 years time. But as I know the grass always seems greener on the other side, I am afraid more than anything of regretting having left. I look at the careers of some high flying academics and realise the same thing.

I like to work hard, but I need to turn off. It will seap into every crack and crevice if you let it. Finding work that fits into a 8 hour work day and going home to be with the people you love is an honourable way to live. ALl the best with finding your way in the mess! Thankfully, I also have a full time job albeit one to tide me over til I get a real one so I am in a better position than most! I can empathise with that feeling — I had many failed attempts at academic job interviews myself before stumbling onto my current career.

I wish you all the best with your search! Far prefer it to law which bores me to tears these days-no wonder motivating myself to finish the thesis is so hard!! I wonder if age at all relates to reasons for leaving. My husband has just decided to quit his PhD.

Possibly it also has to do with identity. Somebody should do a PhD on it…. Perhaps troubles start when people identify only with one role -be it PhD student or parent? My personal experience is one of not fitting into a discipline. Using words which have one meaning for my supervisors but another for me.

This resulted in arguments and a very unpleasant experience. I would have dropped out but for my partner. I am now at another university in a department where we all speak the same language. I feel very positive about my PhD and I enjoy my supervisions. I know this is not a solution for many people but it worked for me.

Why do people quit the PhD? I completed but reasonably often felt discouraged enough to want to quit I was part time, distance ed student with a principal supervisor who was not employed at the university where I was a student, was an external sup.

Research only program I defined the thesis topic. The uni accepted me on that basis. I had no contact with other students so felt like I was in an isolation tank through out the 8 years. I found it hard to know whether my problems were common to others or if they were just my neuroses. I was enrolled in an interstate section of the university where there were no professional associates and I was a fish out of disciplinary water. Psychology dept did not accept me as I was doing a qual research, concept development study that did not fit with their paradigm.

I loved my topic and wanted to do it justice. It propelled me to the end and still holds real interest for me. I see its practical value Unexpectedly I had spinal surgery in which laid me out for around 8 months before I got back to being able to work full time. This made me late and anxious about being able to meet the revised deadline. I was very bad at it until I got better during the last 6 months Supervision was difficult.

This kept my supervisor in line and I was able to complete. I had little contact with supervisor for most of the time. It was a solo experience largely. Another way of looking at it might be to ask yourself: How does this being out of depth communicate itself to the supervisor and affect them? In other words, students are finding it hard to hold onto optimism when the going is tough — when they are required to dig deeply into themselves to find the personal resources to get them over the successive humps of the thesis production process.

I sometimes think of Mandela in jail for many years and wonder just how he found the personal resilience in the broadest sense of the word to emerge with such emotional strength. It was developed precisely in the pit of despair with no escape, and injustice upon injustice heaped upon him. Following a thesis through to its conclusion submission has a similar trajectory: The rubber hits the road there.

I experienced all the narratives many times. Reflecting upon the repetitive nature of my self-stories and the emotional experiences I cycled through brought me to realise this. It was about the need to face up to growing through the experience rather than blaming anyone or anything. The thesis was just a thesis; it was not a personal attack and I was not a victim. I just had to grow up. I hope some of it is helpful!

Thanks for your great blogs, as I find them useful to help process my experience as I wait for my results. This makes a lot of sense to me Joanne; I think who we are as people affects our journey hugely. Inger, this is important work. The fact that bullying and disinterested supervision came out as a major reason why students leave phds is an extremely concerning, even disturbing finding. It would be interesting to investigate what if any mechanisms students have to report bullying, and what systems universities have to deal with it.

The organisation would have very clear legal obligations to act, and financial incentives in terms of trying to reduce escalating workcover insurance premiums. I think the other interesting thing, is that most supervisors do not even have a basic degree in Education. Any other teacher does.

From kindergarten to secondary school, whether they have a previous degree or not. For some reason, HE does not seem to value the basic B. I think many supervisors are not trained to be educators; to understand pedagogy, how students tick, and generally how to teach. Sure, they might be awesome in their topic, but they are not always teachers. They just wing it, and for students that are on the ball, they can see this a mile off.

Supervisors bully to assert the power, rather than approach the supervision from an educators point of view and have collegial discussions. I have never understood why many University supervisors do not have any sort of tertiary education qualification. I think that would provide some consistency across supervision, just like it is expected from teachers in any other sector of learning and education. Good luck at the conference! Do I make any sense? Why do we stay and why do we leave? I suspect much of it is to do with where we are in our lives when we encounter the hard bits, our expectations of ourselves and tolerance for any gap between expectation and reality, how well we can communicate our needs for support and how well our supervisors can help us find what we need.

In my undergrad degree I found I could cram easily as long as I understood the topic, and it came as a big shock that honours required sustained work. I carried a completed one around for weeks but was too embarrassed to hand it in. I communicated very little of this distress to my supervisors. If you like we can talk about what I think is wrong with it and how it could be done better. Before my supervisor realised how bad my progress was he was encouraging me strongly to do a PhD; eventually to make him quit pressuring I said I needed a break and would enrol in Quitting crossed my mind in the dark places but I just kept plodding.

I am coming to accept that I do have very useful things to say and useful insights, and know my topic very well. I suspect that unless you are another person who reacts to stress by freezing, it is a very difficult thing to understand. They do try to help when they see a problem, but the help feels like pressure and pushing to me, which tends to make me stick further and I have to mange my dislike of being pushed.

I wish people could just acknowledge and give me space. Other than repeated practice, two things have helped me learn how to deal with this.

The second thing, and the most powerful, has come from working with one of my horses. All he needed was time and being listened to and having much of the pressure on him removed.

Somehow I managed to rally myself to move on with it, but still in doubt if I can make it in time. Nevertheless, I have to admit that to continue this point so far, is a great effort of myself, that I still go on and try to deal with it. I think quiting the PhD is a tough decision for almost everyone, the reason is various as pointed out in the topic above. In fact, enter the PhD and experience through it is just not that bad, in my opinion.

Many valuable skills and experiences cannot be obtained from somewhere else beyond the PhD, in my humble opinion. Maybe somebody should write some articles about this? Going through a PhD and what we can learn from it? I have come to that stage in my studies where I am quite disenchanted with academia although I was like that not long after I began my PhD. I had these romantic ideas that I was going to be paid to think and impart knowledge.

But it seems so competitive and superficial at times. Also, the fact that your work never seems safe. My own supervisor actually asked to use my work, but said that they would use their own words, for a write up they were doing.

They have a moral obligation to at least cite or give me co-authorship. So why bother killing myself over something that someone will take away, just like that! My supervisor talks big and loud, but never follows through. I am getting sick of being built up, all to have the conversation forgotten. No wonder so many people leave the industry jaded. I love hard things, I love difficulty, but my mental health is in danger. I started my PhD in June It was a dream that came true. But the reality is so different from dreams.

The most important problems are about my thesis topic and my supervisor. She has given me only 2 o 3 references. The problem is both me and my supervisor. I have now only 2 years to finish my PhD I have a grant , and it seems impossible to me. Agne, this sounds more like a supervision problem. I suggest you speak to your supervisor in the first instance and outline your concerns to her and be clear about what you need from supervision at this stage.

If the situation doesnt improve, go see the post grad tutor or equivalent for a chat and discuss your options. Perhaps a change in supervisor may be required.

I had the same issue as you are going through late last year. One of my supervisors took my final proposal away for 2 months only to come back and totally discounting my work and telling me that my idea was not worthy; and while making some suggestions as to the possible direction I could go.

I was left to stroll the academic and literature wilderness. It was worse for me as I am a distance student and live two states away from my uni. I actually got to the stage of seeking out other universities and then resolved to quit. I commenced the quitting paperwork, and then for some reason spoke to a lecturer not my supervisor and this was the best thing I could do.

I ended up talking the head of department and within a week I had two new supervisors, and in the space of 4 months, my final course work was done, and I sat my confirmation seminar and with their help made it through the confirmation.

I would urge you to find someone at the uni and get their help. Or, if you need a compassionate ear, drop me a line. Self advocacy and academic ableism An Ex-academic follower of fashion.

I had a very good and helpful supervisor But the main problem here is myself. I am not capable to do my PHD as what my supervisor required. At first I really wanna enjoy myself doing phd, I keep on telling myself this is the time to improve my knowledge but thing come up differently. In the beginning I thought its good to challenge myself coz by doing this I can improve later on. But now I stress myself a lot, I started to lost confident, passion towards phd.

I am also worried he will lost his patience on my weakness. What should I do? I am not enjoy to do it anymore. I think you need therefore to seek professional advice from a range of people. I would suggest you do this before you take such a big step. Then take a week totally off your thesis. Relax, do some stuff you enjoy.

After you have done all this you will be more informed as to what your options are and hopefully have a bit of emotional distance from what you are feeling at the moment. At least then, if you do decide to quit, you wont look back and regret being impulsive about the decision.

Yes I already talk to supervisor and went to see counselor for an advice. I also had friends around me. I am the only problem, I did study about the research and class which is not my strength and little background but still not improve. I am not really sure what to do then. My SV asked me to think carefully, If I really cannot do it like we know ourselves better , then need to decide early.

Thank you for this post. In my focus groups with PhD students I did not come across the ambivalence narrative, but certainly got a sense of the other two being present. The Resilience narrative was found to be annoying, yes. The expectation to perform is adding even more stress and pressure. Do you get a sense of the average PhD student rushing through their journey to just get it done? I know of several people who dropped out of their PhDs for various reasons and they were very damaged by it.

I completely agree with this. And sometimes what is not right for us at one stage of life may become right at a later date. My biggest struggle is immense, all-encompassing self-doubt and the constant feeling that I have absolutely no control over the work. I am exhausted all the time, I sleep way too much, and I cannot seem to work more than hours a day. My memory fails more and more and most of the time I just want to do things that are relaxing, like long walks, and shopping, which all lead to extreme guilt and self-hatred.

The idea of writing all the chapters seems entirely impossible. It cannot be done. Sorry if this post is unintelligible. Your post is intelligible. I felt much like this during my Honours and at various times during myPhD. I share your frustration at not knowing how much is enough or what is good enough.

Thesis whispering Work Life Rehab. Hi, I found this article very helpful! I have been debating the idea of quitting from my PhD program for about two months now. I am nearing my fourth year and have not yet advanced to candidacy.

I had a lot of financial issues at the beginning of my program as I was not getting any financial aid and had to pay out of my pocket for the love of finishing my degree. Two years into it, and I had no research topic. I started getting financial aid a little over a year ago, and my advisor pressured me to make up for lost time.

We were of course in a great deal of debt, so even though my husband was working full-time at the retail business, he was not getting enough money, so I had to work on the side. That only slowed things in my research progress. After performing my current research on a topic almost completely outside my discipline , I came to the realization that I feel both behind have not advance to candidacy yet and not advancing in my research plus I am losing interest on it.

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